The answer is, of course, both.
Historically, religious tolerance has a very poor record, & even today there are 25 examples of religious-based civil unrest & warfare. Christian against Muslim, Christian against Christian, Muslim against Christian,Muslim against Muslim & everyone against the Jews.
It would seem to me that there is a very strong case for people to abandon organised religion for the sake of harmony.
Any thoughts?

It is true to say that Religion has caused many deaths and many other problems also, but the point is i think, would world development have been worse without it? While will never really know, it is a distinct possibility that it would have.

The number crunching on this would be,how much wrong did the church create, compared to how many good people it created? As i said before, we will never know.

I don't think religion can create good people. It may be that some good people were drawn to the church which enabled them to do good things, but I'm equally sure that the reverse also happened.


The physicist Steven Weinberg said that regardless of religion you will have" good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things." However, "for good people to do evil things, it takes religion."

I don't see how world development could of been worse without religion. Among the millions of people slaughtered in the name of religion there must have been innumerable creative people & great thinkers. As you say, we'll never know.

"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conivtion" Blaise Pascal

The question is whether without religion would man not adopt alternative doctrine? The onset of political religions such Nazism, Fascism and Communism in history dictate that even without religion mankind seems hellbent on murdering and conquering in the name of something.

I'm of the opinion that man alway had, and always will need something to compete with/work against to survive. Whether it's separate individuals, separate tribes or separate countries.

So I'm afraid it won't be until we start seeing little green blokes, that the human race has a chance at banding together as one.

What have Leprechuans got to do with it?

Everything!

This is a hypercrite coming back to you. I said I didn't believe in God but when I was hurt in the Falklands, I shouted out for him. I also shouted for my mum !
Since then I have my own personal God but don't go along with organised religions.

I don't have a problem with anyone who believes in God, I personally don't believe, but everyone to their own.
What I strongly disagree with is religions telling people how they should live their lives whilst wearing funny hats & weird clothes & making a very good living out of it.
Telling a child that if they don't worship a god "they will bow to the mods forever" is tantamount to child abuse.

Religions will tell you that all morals come from religion, BULLSHIT. If religion is moral why have they so cheerfully slaughtered millions in the name of God.




Can someone exlpain why what I wrote was changed?

I have no idea - and my number one suspect wasnt active at the time!

It's not often that AB is wrong but as far as I am concerned, he is right again. More wars have been started and lives lost in the names of various religions.
Even the Christian religion has as it's symbol,,,, a cross which was an instrument of torture and death.

Sure, I believe in my God. He is personal to me but I would not shove my beliefs down peoples throats. There are some people who are 'God Botherers' and need organised religions. The peace that lives inside you is from your own God and as you go about your daily business, you will influence people with that peace.
Please don't get me wrong ! I get angry at certain things,,,,, who doesn't ? Isn't that allowed by the spirit that reigns within ?

Was in Leeds city centre doing some street photography today, and there was a group of about 4-5 Christians with a microphone and an amp, preaching to people in the middle of the street, calling them to "embrace our lord and saviour" and other such sanctimonious b*llocks. Fair enough, they have their religion, it's there and no-one is stopping them. But why do these people feel the necessity to force it down everyone else's throats at each and every opportunity.

I bet my next paycheck, that if an atheist were to do the same and tell people, on a loud speaker, in a busy town centre, to "embrace science and the lack of the organized god" they would be slated for being insensitive to other peoples beliefs, and yet it's the exact same thing.

It is religous people who cause the problems. They cause problems when they think they are doing right by God when they are not, ie forcing their views on people against their will and persecuting people. But when an individual turns to religon of their own free will it can help them alot like this man: David Falcus a former gangland villian and drug addict.
Just watch the testimony of David Falcus if you want to see how religion can make bad people good. Nicky Cruz is also a world famous evangalist who went from extremly bad to good. His story is told in his autobiography "Run Baby Run" and in the book "The Cross and the Switchblade".

how did i miss this thread?

God created only human and it is human who created religion, so main culprit is human not god. god never said to him to create the religion. There are so many religions worldwide and are different from each other it is very difficult for them to gel with each other. Which is not good for world because it may lead to disaster as people merely likes any other religion and thinks that they are superior from other. And in because of this superiority feeling peace cant be maintained for long. So world is going to become hell in near future because of this. Jesus save this world.